No, this is not one of those perennial questions about growing avocados
from a pit. :-)
I posted this in ba.gardens but got no response. Perhaps someone here
knows?
In late October I bought a lovely 3-year-old grafted Bacon avocado tree
from Berkeley Hort. Now that it's in the ground, it's about 3.5 to 4 feet
tall. Assuming it does well, how many years do you think until I get at
least one fruit? The person at the nursery didn't know but nodded when I
said I had heard avocados take about 7 years so this tree had 4 left.
Thanks,
Cyndi
_______________________________________________________________________________
Oakland, California Zone 9 USDA; Zone 16 Sunset Western Garden Guide
Disabled, chemically sensitive, wheelchair user Organic Gardening only
_______________________________________________________________________________
"There's nothing wrong with me. Maybe there's Cyndi Norman
something wrong with the universe." (ST:TNG) cyndi@consultclarity.com
http://www.consultclarity.com
_________________________ Owner of the Immune Lists http://www.best.com/~immune
Date: Mon, 7 Dec 1998 10:35:59 +1300
From: Tony & Moira Ryan
My NZ orchard book says grafted trees take about 4-5 years to come into
bearing, while seedling trees need around 9 years, so there is quite a
time-saving with the grafted ones.
Thanks Moira. Since I bought a "3 year old grafted tree" does this mean
I'll get fruit in 1-2 years? Or is the countdown from another point in the
tree's life? 1-2 years would be awesome...I've been hoping for 4. If it
matters...these are winter bearing (Nov-Jan?) and I planted the tree about
a month ago.
Cyndi
_______________________________________________________________________________
Oakland, California Zone 9 USDA; Zone 16 Sunset Western Garden Guide
Chemically sensitive/disabled - Organic Gardening only by choice and neccessity
_______________________________________________________________________________
"There's nothing wrong with me. Maybe there's Cyndi Norman
something wrong with the universe." (ST:TNG) cyndi@consultclarity.com
http://www.consultclarity.com/
_________________ Owner of the Immune Website & Lists http://www.immuneweb.org/
Cyndi Norman wrote:
> In late October I bought a lovely 3-year-old grafted Bacon avocado tree > from Berkeley Hort. Now that it's in the ground, it's about 3.5 to 4 feet > tall. Assuming it does well, how many years do you think until I get at > least one fruit?
Hi Cyndi
My NZ orchard book says grafted trees take about 4-5 years to come into
bearing, while seedling trees need around 9 years, so there is quite a
time-saving with the grafted ones.
Moira
Tony & Moira Ryan
Wainuiomata, New Zealand
Reply from Kris Johnson to #98.9196911 From cnorman@BEST.COM(Cyndi Norman
Hi Moira and Cyndi,
Having just finished the old book Tree Crops, I wondering if you have to graft onto an existing stump or root stock tree (that is already in the earth growing) for the graft to bear quickly. It doesn't seem like a a three year old sapling, would bear quicker just because it is grafted - unless maybe the studier root stock tends comes from a faster growing tree with a bigger root system. Sometimes the books fail to explain some of the basics!
Kris
--- Original Note #98.9196911 From cnorman@BEST.COM(Cyndi Norman
> My NZ orchard book says grafted trees take about 4-5 years to come into
> bearing, while seedling trees need around 9 years, so there is quite a
> time-saving with the grafted ones.
Is there more to bearing than just time? We have an avacado that grew from
seed and must be at least 10 yrs old with no signs of bearing. A friend of
ours has a couple of seed grown trees that are at least 20 years old and
still no sign of fruit. We live in northern CA maritime climate. Is there
some missing factor? do avocados need some special kind of climate or
feeding system/nutrient needs to bear? We have a loquat that is already
starting to form buds and this will be its second year of bearing and it is
the same age as the avocado. Could it be that seed grown avocados are some
kind of "freaks" that will not bear? just wondering.
Lorie
ritchie@mcn.org
Armand & Lorie Ritchie
Date: Thu, 10 Dec 1998 18:39:38 -0800
From: Armand & Lorie Ritchie
Is there more to bearing than just time? We have an avacado that grew from
seed and must be at least 10 yrs old with no signs of bearing. A friend of
ours has a couple of seed grown trees that are at least 20 years old and
still no sign of fruit. We live in northern CA maritime climate. Is there
some missing factor? do avocados need some special kind of climate or
feeding system/nutrient needs to bear? We have a loquat that is already
starting to form buds and this will be its second year of bearing and it is
the same age as the avocado. Could it be that seed grown avocados are some
kind of "freaks" that will not bear? just wondering.
Loquats and avocados are completely different types of trees. You can't
compare them.
There are many different kinds of avocados. Not all do well in our
climate. In fact, very few do. The commerical growing zones are south of
us or in Florida. Chances are high that the seeds you and your friend grew
came from varieties not suited to our area.
Some people get fruit from seed-grown avocados. But really they are
usually just grown for fun. If you want fruit, spend the $40 for a grafted
tree. The rootstock in particular will be right for this climate and the
scion will be too.
I bought my Bacon avocado at Berkeley Horticultural. They had a very small
selection but the trees are very healthy and well cared for.
Cyndi
_______________________________________________________________________________
Oakland, California Zone 9 USDA; Zone 16 Sunset Western Garden Guide
Chemically sensitive/disabled - Organic Gardening only by choice and neccessity
_______________________________________________________________________________
"There's nothing wrong with me. Maybe there's Cyndi Norman
something wrong with the universe." (ST:TNG) cyndi@consultclarity.com
http://www.consultclarity.com/
_________________ Owner of the Immune Website & Lists http://www.immuneweb.org/
Date: Wed, 9 Dec 1998 23:22:05 -0500
From: KRIS JOHNSON
Having just finished the old book Tree Crops, I wondering if you have to
graft onto an existing stump or root stock tree (that is already in the
earth growing) for the graft to bear quickly. It doesn't seem like a a
three year old sapling, would bear quicker just because it is grafted -
unless maybe the studier root stock tends comes from a faster growing tree
with a bigger root system. Sometimes the books fail to explain some of the
basics!
These are good points. None of this is very clear. I have no way of
knowing the age of the rootstock used for my tree at the time it was
grafted. I am assuming that when they say it's 3 years old they mean the
graft was done 3 years ago. Maybe they mean the rootstock was 3 years old?
From looking at the connection, it's definately grown out and not recent.
I don't know if being in the ground vs a pot will matter...obviously, I
bought the tree in a pot and the rootstock was potted either from the
beginning or for most of its life. I bought the tree in a 5 gallon pot.
Can any of our resident experts/nursery professionals comment? What does
it mean for a grafted tree to be "3 years old?"
Thanks,
Cyndi
_______________________________________________________________________________
Oakland, California Zone 9 USDA; Zone 16 Sunset Western Garden Guide
Chemically sensitive/disabled - Organic Gardening only by choice and neccessity
_______________________________________________________________________________
"There's nothing wrong with me. Maybe there's Cyndi Norman
something wrong with the universe." (ST:TNG) cyndi@consultclarity.com
http://www.consultclarity.com/
_________________ Owner of the Immune Website & Lists http://www.immuneweb.org/
I think, but am not sure that Avocados require a male & female tree. Perhaps
someone with the rights books can look it up.
Armand & Lorie Ritchie wrote:
Cyndi Norman wrote:
Cyndi
My book does not make this crystal-clear, but the implication is 4-5
years from the time the trees ar offered for sale.
All kinds (winter or summer bearers) take about the same time to fruit.
Moira
--
Tony & Moira Ryan
Wainuiomata, New Zealand
KRIS JOHNSON wrote:
> Hi Moira and Cyndi,
> Having just finished the old book Tree Crops, I wondering if you have to graft onto an existing stump or root stock tree (that is already in the earth growing) for the graft to bear quickly. It doesn't seem like a a three year old sapling, would bear quicker just because it is grafted - unless maybe the studier root stock tends comes from a faster growing tree with a bigger root system. Sometimes the books fail to explain some of the basics!
Kris
I am not sure what stocks they use, perhaps simply seedlings, but
possibly rooted cuttings of a type known to have good roots.
It is the scion (top) wood of a graft which in most cases determines how
long the tree will take to bear. This is always wood take from a proved
good variety and comes from a mature plant, not a young seedling. The
grafted plant has to then grow sufficiently to have the strength to
flower and fruit, but since it started from what was already adult
tissue it doesn't take it as long as if it started from a seed and had
to go through its juvenile stage first.
Moira
--
Tony & Moira Ryan
Wainuiomata, New Zealand
Armand & Lorie Ritchie wrote:
Lorie
To answer your last question first. Seed-grown avocados cannot all be
"freaks which do not bear", or where would have all our cultivated
varieties come from? All of them must have originally started as
seedlings which someone realized were winners and grew and multiplied by
grafting.
The problem with seedling trees is that they do not necessarily have
good characteristics and most are less useful than their parents. I
remember seeing once that if you wanted to breed a good new apple
variety you would expect to have to raise AT LEAST 450 seedlings to have
any chance of getting even one as good as the parents you started with.
In any case, if you grow a seed from a fruit you bought, that fruit
could have come from an area with a completely different climate to
yours..
.
You CAN of course be lucky and raise a winner at the first try, but you
are much more likely to get one which is a shy or tardy bearer or one
which is only suited to a different climate. Unlss you really want to be
a breeder you are well advised to get a proved good doer (as a grafted
tree) and be careful to chose one which is known to fruit well in your
area.
Of course there is nothing to stop you keeping your seedling just as a
pleasent ornamental tree and if you get the odd fruit of it sometime I
guess that would be a bonus.
Moira
--
Tony & Moira Ryan
Wainuiomata, New Zealand
Cindy Senicka wrote:
> I think, but am not sure that Avocados require a male & female tree. Perhaps someone with the rights books can look it up.
No Cindy, Avocados do not have separate-sex trees and as far as I know
they are completely self-fertile. I remember one we had on our African
farm which stood alone and cropped every year.
Moira
--
Tony & Moira Ryan
Wainuiomata, New Zealand
Cyndi Norman wrote:
What does it mean for a grafted tree to be "3 years old?"
Cyndi
The age of the rootstock is probably immaterial, except it would have to
have been grown long enough to develop to a good size before being
used. "Three years old" almost certainly means 3 years from the time
the graft was made.
Moira
Tony & Moira Ryan
Wainuiomata, New Zealand
