lots of pulling, a strong weed wacker, sharp shovel, and above all- hot
compost.
bille
Previous owner landscaped with this. Nice groundcover but after many =
years
it has become too much of a good thing -- mounding over itself until =
it's
quite deep on the ground, or insinuating itself through bushes thereby
smothering the lower branches, and of course climbing trees and hanging =
back
down. Property is starting to look like an old Gothic ruin. So, on =
these
mild, late winter days when it's nice enough to be outside but too early =
for
planting, I'm entertaining myself with pulling up the ivy (deer have =
been
helping with the "pruning" of it, but not in all the desired places....)
Questions: how do other folks manage their ivy (assuming any of you have
it); and maybe Kathryn could be esp. informative on what the English do
about it. I've seen it covering entire walls, but I wonder if it takes
longer in England to accomplish this than in warmer Virginia, and if the =
ivy
is a problem outside the garden, the way it is in the States now, having
escaped and out-competing native vegetation?
Pat
Yup, it's invasive. I take an electric hedger to it to keep it in "bounds".
Previous owner landscaped with this. Nice groundcover but after many years
it has become too much of a good thing -- mounding over itself until it's
quite deep on the ground, or insinuating itself through bushes thereby
smothering the lower branches, and of course climbing trees and hanging back
down. Property is starting to look like an old Gothic ruin. So, on these
mild, late winter days when it's nice enough to be outside but too early for
planting, I'm entertaining myself with pulling up the ivy (deer have been
helping with the "pruning" of it, but not in all the desired places....)
Questions: how do other folks manage their ivy (assuming any of you have
it); and maybe Kathryn could be esp. informative on what the English do
about it. I've seen it covering entire walls, but I wonder if it takes
longer in England to accomplish this than in warmer Virginia, and if the ivy
is a problem outside the garden, the way it is in the States now, having
escaped and out-competing native vegetation?
Pat
I have it (from the neighbor, under the fence). I let it spread a couple of years, but now I just yank it up and even dig if it won't yank. It is death to a carrot patch, for instance!
Carol
> Yup, it's invasive. I take an electric hedger to it to keep it in "bounds".
But if you plan to use the area for anything else (like - gulp! - carrots) you really do need to yank out ALL the roots. I think I have succeeded, and that it is far from the worst weed I have had to contend with.
Carol
billevans wrote:
> lots of pulling, a strong weed wacker, sharp shovel, and above all-
> hot compost.
I should have thought myself that cooking in a hot heap to stop it
regrowing would be necessary Bill if it were not that we regularly trim
the ivy which clothes a small brick wall here, and every bit (including
shoots trying to colonise by rooting down in the adjacent gravel) gets
put in my cool compost heap where it is never seen again. Give me ivy
over Wandering Jew every time!
While on the subject, does everybody know that common English Ivy has
two growth phases - climbing and bushy. Where the creeper is allowed to
grow up from the top of wall, or of a pole or tree it has climbed over,
the leaf shape simplifies and the habit becomes bushy. Plants propagated
from this form will continue to grow as bushes and will not ususlly
revert to the climber. It is at this stage incidently that flowers and
black fruits are produced.
Moira
--
Tony & Moira Ryan,
Wainuiomata, North Island, NZ. Pictures of our garden at:-
http://mywebpages.comcast.net/cherie1/Garden/TonyandMoira/index.htm
NEW PICTURES ADDED 4/Feb/2004
Doing pretty well with first and last of these.
Pat
Glad that you also have noticed that, Moira! I have wondered if I was crazy, seeing the ivy as a bushy plant!
Carol
On the subject of English Ivy and trees...will it eventually kill trees
that it climbs into? And if so, how does it accomplish this? I've got
some English Ivy that's growing into a nice big oak tree; looks nice but
I'm worried for the health of the tree. It's not covering the tree,
just climbing up the trunk and out onto the limbs but not covering
foliage or anything. I'm just wondering if I should be getting it out of
there before it's too late.
Deb
Yes, trimming leaves and stems, it's on a bank and also grows up from there
onto a chain linik fense . on the ground, it gets quite thick and one can
shear it down some occasionally, shear it vertically on the fense, too, as
well as 'vertically' along the edges or actually, I shear it not vertically
but at an angle because I don't like that thick, tall edge
cover.
Its a native here remember, so on the whole it stays in balance. I haven't
seen how it behaves in Virginia but from comments down the years it seems
that it is altogether too happy with you. It will cheerfully climb my
(single storey) house in the course of a summer but I can equally
cheerfully cut it off at the roots and pull it down again. I don't ever let
it get in under the edge of a roof since it can really do severe damage in
a situation like this. Likewise I can pull it up and it stays pulled. You
have to remember that, as a native, it is an important host species for our
wildlife and supports a big range of native insect life, as well as being
an important nesting site for many species of birds and the berries are a
very valuable wildlife food source in late winter carrying berry eating
species through when other food sources are gone. There are big debates
about whether or not it kills trees when it climbs up and festoons itself
around but on the whole the feeling is that only sick trees are likely to
get killed off and its habitat value greatly outweighs the damage it does.
I'm not too happy about this myself - the weight of the ivy on a shallow
rooted species can bring trees down in a gale that would otherwise have
survived happily for many years. I leave it alone where I want it and heave
it out where I don't.
kathryn
Deb wrote:
> On the subject of English Ivy and trees...will it eventually
> kill trees that it climbs into?
By now you've seen Kathryn's post on this.
Here are some pieces of info I've picked up from various Internet =
articles
1) EI doesn't actually kill the trees into which it climbs; it attaches
itself to the trunk and branches but it's not taking nourishment from =
these;
2) EI can make trees top heavy and/or provide resistance to wind; either =
way
promotes toppling of trees in strong winds;
3) roots "steal" valuable water and nutrients from the trees and other
vegetation in the area. This is important to us, here in Virginia, =
during
drought years.
4) EI smothers native vegetation on the ground and apparently is NOT the
important food source for wildlife here that Kathryn mentions for her =
part
of the world.
5) recommended way to get it off trees: with saw or other sharp tool, =
cut
the vine at (your) shoulder height and again at the bottom of the tree,
being careful of course not to cut into the tree itself. Unpeel this
segment from the tree. Don't reach up and try to pull the higher stuff =
as
you could bring down a mess of who knows what on top of you; it will =
die,
rot, and eventually fall down of its own accord. Meanwhile, back on the
ground, grab a vine or two and start peeling it back from the tree. It
helps to have two people: one to peel and another to cut the roots so =
the
first person can keep peeling back.
6) am still investigating whether EI has allelopathic effects, so as to
decide what to do with the nice big pile of ramial wood that Husband
recently chipped which includes vast quantity of EI lately pulled out.
Pat
Kathryn wrote:
> Its a native here remember, so on the whole it stays in
> balance. I haven't seen how it behaves in Virginia but from
> comments down the years it seems that it is altogether too
> happy with you.
It was almost, recently, reclassified as a Noxious Weed. I forget why =
the
state legislature didn't do it. Probably pressure from the nursery
industry. Virginia isn't the only state being overrun with it. I've =
been
reading about an extensive "control" (their having given up on
"eradication") program in the Pacific NW somewhere.
> It will cheerfully climb my (single storey)
> house in the course of a summer but I can equally cheerfully
> cut it off at the roots and pull it down again.
We have a lot of ground covered by it. Even if we pulled it just once a
year, that's a lot of ivy to pull. Certain areas, like walkways and the
screened porch, have to be cleared two or three times between March and
November.
> I don't ever
> let it get in under the edge of a roof since it can really do
> severe damage in a situation like this.
We don't let it even begin to climb the house.
Most of ours is in the juvenile state, so no berries. I'm sure that, =
like
Russian Olive, it's good for wildlife here, too. The big problem seems =
to be
that it out-competes our native flora, as does Russian Olive. They're =
both
lovely to look at....but they're much too much of a good thing.
> There are big debates about whether or not
> it kills trees when it climbs up and festoons itself around
See my post to Deb Blaithin.
> I leave it alone where I
> want it and heave it out where I don't.
Which is, after all, what I'm doing. The reason it's such a big job =
NOW,
though, is because places where it was OK are now distressingly thick =
with
the stuff, small shrubs are disappearing, and it's hanging down from =
great
heights in the trees looking like Tarzan swings. A bit much.
Pat
I think also that my blackberry, the original plant, is killing or has killed, my sour cherry tree. Either that, or I completely missed the cherries last summer, as well as the cherry blossoms, and that I doubt.
And it doesn't cover the tree completely either!
Carol
Don't know whether it is allelopathic - doubt it since it doesn't kill its
hosts - but slugs in this garden don't seem to like crossing a mulch of
chippings with an ivy content - mind you they don't like fresh chippings
much anyway.
Where we want it as a tight ground cover (on a couple of banked hedge
bottoms where there are also ferns we want to keep) we use a brush hog to
mow it
kathryn
Most of those observations, could be applied to poison ivy too, except
it is native, and I think the birds and wildlife do like it.
susan
The problem with letting it grow up a tree is as Moira points out that's
when the ivy produces seeds. The seeds then colonize other areas that
don't want the ivy either. So really, in the US it's very important to
not let it grow up and produce seeds. That's when it really gets invasive.
Deborah Turton
John, is it good for dogs, for parasites?
a
> breather, the local birds are not deprived of a nesting site and the ivy
is
had some of the guys at the Arches restaurant dig out a section of the ivy
on the bank (I'm glad I didn't have to do it) and the owner had some grape
vines put in by one of the vintners from where he buys his wine, I've
terraced it and put in different herbs and other plants among the vines. I
just keep the ivy that's left sheared away at the edges. I made a "fancy" A
out of creeping rosemary and clip it about 3 X a year and keep the ivy from
encroaching on it. Had a snake back there and either the guys there killed
it or it moved on after clearing out the moles. I told them to leave snakes
alone if they see one. Probably see fewer rats if there was a snake in
residence on that bank.
Amy wrote:
Thanks, Amy. Some useful ideas here. In the more open places where we want
it as ground cover, I like the idea of shearing it. That'd mean the roots
stay in place. In the places where it's too crowded to shear, as between
bushes, and where it's threading its merry way through (and sometimes over)
the bushes, pulling it out seems the better strategy: gets the roots out,
for less competition for water and nutrients, and greatly increases the time
until new vines wind their way back in. I wish I'd thought of shearing at
an angle last month, *before* I cut away a ton of it from the walkways. Next
time (there'll always be a next time....)
Pat
Moira wrote:
I hadn't thought one way or another about it until I read info at a =
website
of the folks in the Pacific NW trying to bring EI under control. They =
warn
not to leave piles of it lying around, as it can re-root itself. I =
can't
offer any evidence about this, as we are not likely to leave the stuff =
lying
around. It gets shredded if we need more ramial wood; it goes into the
compost pile (ours our "hot" piles) if Husband needs a green material =
for
this.
I did know about the difference between the juvenile and the mature =
states,
but I didn't know that plants propagated from the mature plant would
continue to grow as bushes. How very interesting!
Not that I'm gonna rush out and take cuttings from mature plants. No, =
not
likely at all since the only mature EI we have is growing out of the top =
of
some very tall trees! We can't even see the difference in the leaf
formation, or the berries.
Pat
Kathryn wrote:
Ooooh! Thanks for the tip! I recently read the same thing about =
lantana
leaves but I won't have them until later this summer. EI leaves we =
*always*
have.
> Where we want it as a tight ground cover (on a couple of
> banked hedge bottoms where there are also ferns we want to
> keep) we use a brush hog to mow it
That sounds like a "bigger" version of Amy's shearing it. Leaves the =
roots
in place, doesn't disturb the soil, but keeps the stuff under control.
On the subject of allelopathy, I'm looking right now at a report from =
Emory
Univ. on an experiment in Georgia and one from Univ. of Calif. at =
Berkeley,
which note that different plants exhibited different responses when =
grown
with EI present. If I weren't about to fall asleep, I'd read both =
reports
in their entirety, but that's not gonna happen tonight. By the way, I =
found
these by doing a google search on: "English Ivy" + allelopathic effects
Good night to all.
Pat
Ivy is not a parasite, If it does damage to a tree it is because it makes a
network around it that does not allow sufficient expansion of the host
trunk. It takes a long time though before it has so covered a big healthy
tree. And with an oak probably longer still because oaks (at least the
European ones) keep a lot of dried leaves over the winter and so restrict
light for the ivy even in winter.
I am always on the lookout for some harvestable ivy because I think it is
important anti parasite medication for ruminants as wel as food. Sheep and
goats love it.
Sometimes I will pull down part of the ivy growing up in a tall tree. This
way my animals are happy with the snack and the tree is definitely getting a
breather, the local birds are not deprived of a nesting site and the ivy is
not being destroyed.
There is real truth in the saying that as soon as you can see a use for a
weed it stops being a problem.:))
john
> John, is it good for dogs, for parasites?
To me it tastes very bitter and I don't doubt that dogs would think the
same. You would have some trouble forcing it in to them Amy. My dogs prefer
fodder beet at this time of year to get rid of their internal parasites.
But herbivores like ivy and it seems to help with even liver fluke. Ivy is a
relative of the ginsengs by the way.
john
> I am always on the lookout for some harvestable ivy because I think it
is
> important anti parasite medication for ruminants as wel as food. Sheep
and
> goats love it.
> Sometimes I will pull down part of the ivy growing up in a tall tree.
This
> way my animals are happy with the snack and the tree is definitely
getting
> a
> breather, the local birds are not deprived of a nesting site and the ivy
> is
> not being destroyed.
> There is real truth in the saying that as soon as you can see a use for
a
Thanks everyone for your input on my question dealing with EI killing
trees. The reason I'd asked in the first place was because I seem to
recall either reading, or being told, years ago that EI would kill trees
that it climbed into. I wasn't sure how this could be since I knew it
wasn't parasitic...I figured it must be the fact that it might
eventually "smother" a smaller tree, or maybe the bark would somehow be
damaged, thus causing stress and eventual death to the tree. I think
what I'll do is "thin" the EI that is climbing into the tree, because it
is pretty robust looking up there!
Thanks again!
Deb
thanks for the info, John ;-D
prefer
> fodder beet at this time of year to get rid of their internal parasites.
> But herbivores like ivy and it seems to help with even liver fluke. Ivy is
a
ivy
> is
> not being destroyed.
> There is real truth in the saying that as soon as you can see a use
for
Hi , Everyone i just got a english ivy .. any suggents , on how to
care for it . I have it hanging from my ceiling .would apperciate any
adive , thanks
Rose
Yours sounds the best Grant. Rose Did you have a nice Thanksgiving? We did
except for Grandson who fell at school and had to go to hospital and have
four stitches put in his head above his eye. One little boy broke his arm in
three places. Our Emmanuel is fine. Rose
-------Original Message-------
--- In houseplants@yahoogroups.com, Grant Meyer
wrote:
> Hi Rose and all,
> =20=20=20
> Congrats on your new English ivy! I'm sure others will chime in
but I have good success keeping them quite cool and bright with
average to very high humidity. My best ones are grown in the kitchen
or bathroom where humidity stays high.=20
on how to
- In houseplants@yahoogroups.com, "rolandrose"
> Yours sounds the best Grant. Rose Did you have a nice Thanksgiving?
We did
> except for Grandson who fell at school and had to go to hospital and
have
> four stitches put in his head above his eye. One little boy broke
his arm in
--- In houseplants@yahoogroups.com, "rolandrose"
> Hi Rose this is the Rose in Paris and I just wanted to tell you to water
> enough to not get too dry. Hope it does well. If it is humid it
should do
Rose, I'm a little behind in the list but sick of being in bed so checking out
things. I'm sick as a dog & now have bronchitis. I jokingly told my oldest
son (we share a home together) "I'm tired of being sick - it's not fun any
more." He laughed & asked when is it ever fun. I told him the first day or
two was okay as I mainly slept but now I'm still sick, feel crappy but am
bored as I don't feel good enough to read or concentrate for long.
Rose, since you're in Canada & much of Canada is very cold in winter, the air
inside is very dry (I'm near Vancouver & we're having some yucky cold weather
now - even a little snow
drier) than lower down as heat rises. Grant already mentioned that ivy likes
humid conditions. That doesn't mean wet soil but humid air around its leaves.
And if you consider where ivy grows naturally outside, the light requirements
are fairly high. It probably isn't that bright in a corner of the room near
the ceiling.
If you don't have a place that's brighter for it, just make sure to keep the
soil more on the dry side than wet & to mist it lots. Let it go into a rest
period & not try to make it grow much this winter. It should take off in
spring with more light & longer daylight hours. It doesn't hurt it at all to
keep it on the cool side since English ivy is naturalised in the Pacific
Northwest around here & grows wild. Even with some nasty cold spells, the
leaves never die or freeze. It doesn't really like being too warm unless it's
also quite humid & bright.
Judy
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I like English Ivy, in it's place. I do not plant it around trees. I have
three trellises and have planted it around them. I also use it as a screen
on my deck. You have to know the attributes of the plant and use it with
discretion. I find, if planted wisely, it can be a beautiful plant.
Besides, it stay green all winter here.
Marilyn
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I have it planted on a hillside where I could never get grass to grow due t=
o
the slant of the ground and the fact that it only gets morning sun...dogs
love it...they lounge on it in the shade during the hot summer months and i=
t
is indestructable...kept in check simply by mowing.
Vicki
-------Original Message-------
From: Marilyn Warren
Date: 1/31/2008 12:56:30 PM
To: gardenmessenger@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [gardenmessenger] Re: English Ivy
I like English Ivy, in it's place. I do not plant it around trees. I have
three trellises and have planted it around them. I also use it as a screen
on my deck. You have to know the attributes of the plant and use it with
discretion. I find, if planted wisely, it can be a beautiful plant.
Besides, it stay green all winter here.
Marilyn
In a message dated 1/31/2008 11:57:20 A.M. Central Standard Time,
mjwarren@dowco.com
I like English Ivy,
I like English Ivy also, and it stays green here too. If you check out our
web site and go to our home you can see how it is growing here on our nativ=
e
stone home. Has been growing here for 30 years and has caused no problem, w=
e
just keep cut away from where we don't want it.
_www.homestead.com/spoos_ (http://www.homestead.com/spoos) click on our
home the Ivy is growing behind the Sun Face water feature.
ShirleyLee
_www.homestead.com/spoos_ (http://www.homestead.com/spoos)
remember if the world didn't suck we would all fall off
**************Start the year off right. Easy ways to stay in shape.
http://body.aol.com/fitness/winter-exercise?NCID=3Daolcmp00300000002489
In a message dated 1/31/2008 12:04:38 P.M. Central Standard Time,
mom2emsar@fuse.net
planted on a hillside where I could never get grass to grow
What a good idea. I think I will plant some on my pond damm. Maybe it will
choke out the stuff I don't like but can't seem to get rid of, without take=
ing
a chance on killing my fish.
ShirleyLee
_www.homestead.com/spoos_ (http://www.homestead.com/spoos)
remember if the world didn't suck we would all fall off
**************Start the year off right. Easy ways to stay in shape.
http://body.aol.com/fitness/winter-exercise?NCID=3Daolcmp00300000002489
Hello everyone,
I am a new member. I look forward to chatting with you all. Gardning is my =
passion. Good day.
This is Jois
Enjoy!!!!!!!!!!
----- Original Message ----
From: "lees10poos@aol.com
To: gardenmessenger@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, 31 January, 2008 8:17:38 PM
Subject: Re: [gardenmessenger] Re: English Ivy
In a message dated 1/31/2008 12:04:38 P.M. Central Standard Time,
mom2emsar@fuse. net writes:
planted on a hillside where I could never get grass to grow
What a good idea. I think I will plant some on my pond damm. Maybe it will
choke out the stuff I don't like but can't seem to get rid of, without take=
ing
a chance on killing my fish.
ShirleyLee
_www.homestead. com/spoos_ (http://www.homestea d.com/spoos)
remember if the world didn't suck we would all fall off
************ **Start the year off right. Easy ways to stay in shape.
http://body. aol.com/fitness/ winter-exercise? NCID=3Daolcmp00300 000002489
Can someone post a picture of English Ivy?
This is Jois
Enjoy!!!!!!!!!!
----- Original Message ----
From: Marilyn Warren
To: gardenmessenger@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, 31 January, 2008 7:56:18 PM
Subject: Re: [gardenmessenger] Re: English Ivy
I like English Ivy, in it's place. I do not plant it around trees. I have
three trellises and have planted it around them. I also use it as a screen
on my deck. You have to know the attributes of the plant and use it with
discretion. I find, if planted wisely, it can be a beautiful plant.
Besides, it stay green all winter here.
Marilyn
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Garden Gnome in Ontario, Canada Zone 6A
Come wander through my blogs:
gardening: http://ca.360.yahoo.com/sfg.oamc, http://gardengnomewanderings.b=
logspot.com
cooking: http://momskitchencooking.blogspot.com
----- Original Message ----
From: Jois Chitika
To: gardenmessenger@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Monday, February 11, 2008 8:16:15 AM
Subject: Re: [gardenmessenger] Re: English Ivy
Can someone post a picture of English Ivy?
This is Jois
Enjoy!!!!!!! !!!
----- Original Message ----
From: Marilyn Warren
To: gardenmessenger@ yahoogroups. com
Sent: Thursday, 31 January, 2008 7:56:18 PM
Subject: Re: [gardenmessenger] Re: English Ivy
I like English Ivy, in it's place. I do not plant it around trees. I have
three trellises and have planted it around them. I also use it as a screen
on my deck. You have to know the attributes of the plant and use it with
discretion. I find, if planted wisely, it can be a beautiful plant.
Besides, it stay green all winter here.
Marilyn
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Looking for last minute shopping deals?
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category.php?category=3Dshopping
--- In gardenmessenger@yahoogroups.com
wrote:
com>
> Sent: Thursday, 31 January, 2008 7:56:18 PM
> Subject: Re: [gardenmessenger] Re: English Ivy
> I like English Ivy, in it's place. I do not plant it around trees.
I have
> three trellises and have planted it around them. I also use it as a
screen
> on my deck. You have to know the attributes of the plant and use it
with
answer. Try it
Yeah, I passed by your blogspot and found it very informative. I have been =
seeing the plant but was not aware of its name. I just knew 'Ivy' but not '=
English Ivy'.
Thanks a lot.
This is Jois
Enjoy!!!!!!!!!!
----- Original Message ----
From: Garden Gnome
To: gardenmessenger@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Monday, 11 February, 2008 4:09:47 PM
Subject: Re: [gardenmessenger] Re: English Ivy
Here's a link to an entry with picture that I made on English Ivy on my gar=
dening blog http://gardengnomew anderings. blogspot. com/2007/ 06/english- =
ivy.html English ivy is quite lovely and we have a lot of it as ground cove=
r. It does present a lot of problems by providing rodent cover, damaging bu=
ildings and fences, as well as being very invasive.
Garden Gnome in Ontario, Canada Zone 6A
Come wander through my blogs:
gardening: http://ca.360. yahoo.com/ sfg.oamc, http://gardengnomew andering=
s. blogspot. com
cooking: http://momskitchenc ooking.blogspot. com
----- Original Message ----
From: Jois Chitika
To: gardenmessenger@ yahoogroups. com
Sent: Monday, February 11, 2008 8:16:15 AM
Subject: Re: [gardenmessenger] Re: English Ivy
Can someone post a picture of English Ivy?
This is Jois
Enjoy!!!!!!! !!!
----- Original Message ----
From: Marilyn Warren
To: gardenmessenger@ yahoogroups. com
Sent: Thursday, 31 January, 2008 7:56:18 PM
Subject: Re: [gardenmessenger] Re: English Ivy
I like English Ivy, in it's place. I do not plant it around trees. I have
three trellises and have planted it around them. I also use it as a screen
on my deck. You have to know the attributes of the plant and use it with
discretion. I find, if planted wisely, it can be a beautiful plant.
Besides, it stay green all winter here.
Marilyn
____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _
Looking for last minute shopping deals?
Find them fast with Yahoo! Search. http://tools. search.yahoo. com/newsearc=
h/ category. php?category=3D shopping
